hf1

Making san pro's cheaper.... UPDATE!! They're ready!!

My avatar
flutterby
Cloth Nappy Prophet
Cloth Nappy Prophet

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby flutterby » Fri May 22, 2009 2:31 pm

Velvetsteph wrote:sure for just materials but there's the running costs, plus having the equipment and also expertise and time... Yes £5 may seem like a lot for labour costs but the ones i've paid £6 for are hand dyed too which adds more time and dye costs too...

[ Mobile Post ] Image



A huge amount of electric (washing) and detergent, go into making anything hand dyed, most of my dyed fabric washed up about 7 times

My avatar
moonfruit
Sucker for Cloth Nappies
Sucker for Cloth Nappies

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby moonfruit » Fri May 22, 2009 7:18 pm

I would def be interested in trying new san pro. I really like minkee and velboa topped, and like pul, fleece and wool backed.

But happy to try anything. If you could produce things that cost less than £5 and could still make a profit I don't think you'd struggle to find customers.

If you need a tester please give me a shout

Lisa x

My avatar
Emma S
Cloth Nappy Nutter
Cloth Nappy Nutter

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby Emma S » Fri May 22, 2009 9:16 pm

The other thing to consider is that its not generally just a case of cutting out all the same size and whizzing round the edges - it would be too bulky at the sides, especially with the more absorbant/ night pads, or in my case with the wool backing, and if too bulky it makes wrap around wings hard to function properly. The inners are generally cut smaller than the outer layers, and I know my night pads have further inner layers which are just through the core. These need to be all stitched together prior to assembly, and then stitched to the top layers or they would flap about and all bunch up after a wash or two. The stitching also helps to 'channel' any blood into the more absorbant core. My night pads can have up to 5 layers, so its an awful lot of stitching which is not seen from the outside, even accounting for same size layers stitched together.
Added to the cost of fabric is the shipping costs - generally minkee or bulk ordered fabrics come from the states, especially if you are after bamboos or organic fabrics. Alot of the speciality minkees are only available in the states.

The wool backing also has to be felted, which is admittedly done when felting wool for longies/soakers, etc, but that still involves 2 or more lots of 90 degree washing followed by 2 hours of tumble drying on full heat. The wool interlock is (with the exhange rate as it is) about £12 a meter, plus shipping works out another £2-3 per meter. Felting shrinks it by 30%, so fabric wise its quite pricey.

My avatar
craftynclothy
Cloth Nappy Follower
Cloth Nappy Follower

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby craftynclothy » Fri May 22, 2009 10:07 pm

I understand that it probably doesn't cost a huge amount to make pads when you look at making a couple for yourself BUT I think you have underestimated the cost somewhat (when you look from a business pov):

In addition there are costs such as:
a) shipping of fabrics
b) costs of fabric (can vary hugely depending on exchange rate too)
b) threads, electricity, etc.
c) time taken to cut out/sew
d) time/resources used to prewash fabric
e) upkeep of sewing machines/overlockers/etc
f) dyes and time/resources needed for that
g) pattern design/testing
h) costs of running website to sell them on, costs of advertising yourself, etc.

Then on top of all that the people making them want to make some profit.

FWIW on most craft sites I'm on the recommended way of calculating prices is materials x 2 plus time at £10 per hour

My avatar
ems
Cloth Nappy Passionata
Cloth Nappy Passionata

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby ems » Sat May 23, 2009 9:51 am

I'm very sorry, I didn't mean to say that anyone here had extortionate prices, and I truely appologise if I've got on the wrong side of any here, I really didnt mean any harm :( I totally agree, if you planning on dying etc, your electricity water bills and your time is huge. I know it sounds silly but I make loads of stuff for ppl, and not always for great profit, I love my friends to be able to use cloth nappies, and of course, want to use them, and love doing so.

But big companies that whip these things out in plain cottons with etc at pittance per metre.. I'm not going to name names.... factory made piece work items etc.. they really can't cost as much. I realise that when theres a fad, companies will up the price as the demand is high. I totally agree that a handmade item is usually better mande than a bob standard factory made piece item, its its nice to have something that is pretty, if you want it. But for a *bob standard* turned and topstitched piece of cotton with some core absorbancy, 6-8 pounds is just truely excessive! Considering the profit margin on a nappy, and one a san pro item.. theres a huge difference.

I buy most fabric from the UK, I'm lucky that I have ppl working in fabric, so I am lucky in that respect. Lots of my fabric comes prewashed.

Servicing I do myself, I went on a course 5 yrs ago, and have since serviced my own machines. Doing that gave me contact for parts etc, as some of my machines are quite old I ended up buying cheap machines on ebay to take parts off.

I have a pfaff 261 which is the spare to my 262, which I use for workhorse sewing and embroidery...
I have a Pfaff 1197 which is the spare to my 1222e ;) I use for making seat slings and backrests and seating and straps for wheelchairs.
I have a pfaff creative 1471 which is the spare to my 1475cd... My making things pretty machine! And general stitching machine.
Pfaff 796 hobbylock.. spare overlocker, only for inside seams really, its not a very forgiving machine!
Huskylock 905 - which is my new overlocker, as I wanted a pretty, decorative stitch - goes round corners alot better than the old pfaff, and just a few more option on it.. hmm alot easier to thread if you need to!!!

The huskylock is the only new machine I've bought, as I wanted a pretty, decorative stitch.. the pfaff is ok.. but only for inside seams really, its not a very forgiving machine! I really wanted an industerial overlocker, but I use the foot pedals with my elbow, and as they are all knee and foot pedals, it wouldnt have been an option for me.


Sewing is a hobby which I make a little pocket money from, it means I have an excuse to spend mights in the sewing room with my fabrics. My actual job is, what I went to uni for, is a freelance programmer and I teach piano and viola. So I get good income from my work, and the rest pays for my hobbies.

My avatar
gayleygoo
Cloth Nappy Passionata
Cloth Nappy Passionata

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby gayleygoo » Mon May 25, 2009 8:02 pm

craftynclothy wrote:FWIW on most craft sites I'm on the recommended way of calculating prices is materials x 2 plus time at £10 per hour


:hohoho: :hohoho: :hohoho:

Imagine WAHMs used that calculation! I don't know anyone who'd buy a pair of longies at £150 :shock: Most mums are WAHMs to make "pin money", or to cover the cost of their crafting, like you said. I'd be knitting in the evenings anyway and there's only so much wool my DD can wear :giggle: You might find that it will still take a while to make back the cost of starting up your business, plus the continual re-investment of money buying more fabric and promoting yourself further. You may decide to have a stock of pads, plus take custom orders etc, so you'll often have unsold stock too. If you accept money by paypal, they also charge a small fee plus a % of the total. Travel to the PO, ordering fabrics, setting up your work area, sorting problems and dealing with customers also takes time.

It always shocks me when I get an item of clothing from a highstreet shop, covered in beading and embroidery for relatively little money. Most of that stuff is handworked, or done on machine by workers paid pennies. :shock: WAHMs represent the real cost of ethical shopping.

Cheaper san-pro sounds good :D I don't mind paying £5 or £6 for a pad thats well made and comfy. Ive made a few pads myself and would probably make loads if i had an overlocker as a sewing machine just takes too long.

My avatar
craftynclothy
Cloth Nappy Follower
Cloth Nappy Follower

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby craftynclothy » Tue May 26, 2009 8:51 am

gayleygoo wrote:
craftynclothy wrote:FWIW on most craft sites I'm on the recommended way of calculating prices is materials x 2 plus time at £10 per hour


:hohoho: :hohoho: :hohoho:

Imagine WAHMs used that calculation! I don't know anyone who'd buy a pair of longies at £150 :shock: Most mums are WAHMs to make "pin money", or to cover the cost of their crafting, like you said.



:giggle: I'd have to charge a lot more than that per hour to keep up with the cost of buying yarn, fabric & beads...I have an obsession! :oops:

My avatar
JennyPenny
Cloth Nappy Nutter
Cloth Nappy Nutter

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby JennyPenny » Fri May 29, 2009 8:34 pm

I don't know anything about making cloth san pro, but you sound like you really want to give people a good buy. If you want anybody to test your products, feel free to contact me, I am happy to pay the prices you are talking about. I have just started using cloth san pro, and I have found it very expensive. I had to sell nappies and use that money (which would have otherwise gone on more nappies). And I don't yet have enough for full use (I actually only have 2 here, but several on the way from real nappy week discounts). I would LOVE to find somewhere that sells cheap cloth san pro!

My avatar
ems
Cloth Nappy Passionata
Cloth Nappy Passionata

Re: Making san pro's cheaper....

Postby ems » Sat May 30, 2009 9:32 am

Excellent! Well with all these lovely replies, I've decided to give it a go!!

K, choices choices!! OK, I think what we'll do to start is give a few testers exaclty what they want, as it would be silly to give everyone a *regular* pad if its not actually what they need to use!! Also I dont want to be making pads that ppl dont want to buy, so I think I'll keep it the same as the nappies.. bespoke.... though I think everyone seems to like the hourglass shape and 2 snaps for adjustment ...

You choose:

1) Length of pad
2) Next to skin fabric ( fleece, , minkee, cotton jersey, or bamboo jersey)
3) Core fabric (microterry, bamboo terry, Bamboo fleece)

So far I've tested, and had a friend test a few hourglass shaped pads with the following layers...

minkee top - Gelato!! Which I thought was lovely as its very very soft, and is very hard to stain!
2 layers of bamboo fleece core, one slightly smaller than the other
PUL layer
Cotton jersey back

The wings were from the layers of minky PUL and the cotton jersey with a KAM snap to hold in place. The middle layers were stitched together, and then the whole lot was overlocked.
The only pretty thing I really did to them was to stich small flowers all the way down the centre of the pad.. on the embroidery machine to sort of see if it kept the erm blood towards the centre. Friend tell me it worked for her, but then again she didnt have one without the flowers!! Seemed to work for me too.. but again.. I didnt have one without the flowers!! But I did like the look of them!! Nice having lots of sewing machines as I sew things together on one, embroider flowers on the next, adn then overlock the lot together on the next one!!

My friend didn't like the thought of the whole idea at first, but promised me she would try them .. last week she phoned me up and declared she was a convert, but as she only had two cloth pads she had to revert back to her bodyform pads ;) I did ask her whether or not she thought that the overlocked edge would be irriatating, it doesn't bother me as I don't have any feeling below my tummy button... so I'm relying on her to tell me if its scatchy etc or not!!!
The wings are nice and slim as its only the minkee, PUL and quite thin cotton jersey to be folded round the knickers, not the thicker bamboo fleece :)

I'll get my partner ( heheheheeeeee) to draw the layers like an engineering drawing ( he's a graphic designer and does architectual drawings for shopping malls and then gets ppl walking round them and stuff in videos .. if you get the idea so I'm sure he wouldnt mind drawing san pros'!!!

Soooo if we start with a few ppl all getting a custom pad each, and then we can either merge the ideas together, or just carry on making custom pads!!

So far from reading back through this topic, the pll who have said "I'll be a tester" ( ;) ) I will give first dibs for testing slots ;)

Frances
Clairelana
Joaninha
Mummytofive
Jenny Penny

If I have missed out anyone please tell me!!! I think if we do eight test slots on here, we'll get some pretty good ideas!!I have a few from off the forum too.
Last edited by ems on Sat May 30, 2009 9:57 am, edited 3 times in total.

PreviousNext

Return to Wahm grapevine